On Being Blog

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View on PakistanA Pakistani rickshaw driver waits for customers at a commercial market in Rawalpindi on October 8, 2012. (Photo by Farooq Naeem/AFP/GettyImages)

My interest in Pakistan and its people didn't start with politics. Although Pakistan was far away from my Jewish American experience, from the few encounters I had with Pakistani people, I must have instinctively identified — or projected — notions I thought I recognized. Like Israelis and Jews, Pakistanis are also a people with a new country, born of turmoil and trauma (around the same time as Israel) and still under construction. Like Jews living in the diaspora, I gathered that Pakistanis abroad also care passionately about the place where they are not, and struggle to reconcile multiple identities. Their country appeared to me to be a place of contradictions that can perhaps best be described though an epic kaleidoscope fusing history and fantasy.

Then there was the Pakistan depicted in the news. At some points during the 1990s, Pakistan came across as a country of stylish, modern Muslim political leaders with putatively democratic intentions, who were sometimes steeped in accusations of corruption. Then for about a decade following 2001, Western media typically focused on Pakistan as a nuclear-armed hotbed of religious extremism. It was never clear to me who truly held power, and the state often seemed to be on the verge of disaster — or embroiled in it.

I confess that my knowledge ends there. But the fascination remains.

"We are the real Pakistan"Pakistani students take part of a protest against an anti-Islam film after the Friday prayers in front of the Faisal Mosque in Islamabad on September 28, 2012. (Photo by Farooq Naeem/AFP/GettyImages)

So when an American colleague told me that two liberal Pakistanis were interested in establishing contact with like-minded Israelis such as those from +972 Magazine, the liberal, independent blog where I write, I jumped at the opportunity.

These two Pakistanis, who both live in the West, have provided me with a new window on their country. One is a United States-based scholar of religious fundamentalism. Another is one of the founders, editors, and writers of a liberal, independent blog called Let Us Build Pakistan (LUBP).

From our first conversation, I felt we understood each other; surely in part because we felt like peers, who were similarly engaged and passionate about the public affairs of each country. Our conversations have the broad goal of learning more about one another's political, social, and cultural realities, and possibly sharing those realities with our readers through our blogs. Geographically scattered, we have met only on Skype.

Yet even this limited channel allows me to pursue a more nuanced mapping of the socio-political environment of Pakistan than mainstream Western media offer. I find it refreshing to speak with like-minded people facing similar challenges in the country they are trying to build.

For example, we are both critical of state policies we believe to be destructive. But our young societies often react to such criticism defensively. We are commonly treated with suspicion or even hostility by the political and social establishment — which perpetuates those very policies.

Another realization was that all of us are deeply troubled by the alliance of religious extremists with the military establishment and political leaders in Pakistan, a phenomenon which is unfortunately familiar for me: this is precisely how Israel has established and entrenched the occupation of Palestinian territory since 1967. To this day, Israel's justification of the Occupation rests on a mixture of security concerns, religious grounds, and the notion that the internal political costs of concession are too high for Israeli leaders.

The struggle against state-reinforced militarism is another towering issue for my Pakistani colleagues, just as the entrenched militarism of Israeli life is an on-going source of sadness for me.

My Pakistani colleagues feel that mainstream international media has not sufficiently covered human rights abuses in Pakistan, such as the worsening assault on the Shia population, bemoaned by many Pakistanis. Similarly, we at +972 Magazine felt that crucial topics about the Occupation and other aspects of life in Israel were not being covered due to commercial or political unpopularity.

Nonetheless, despite all these shared troubles, our conversations have made me optimistic.

Ultimately it is our mutual commitment to universal values — human rights, democracy, and freedom of expression — that has brought us all together. We are learning from each other about the role these values can play in addressing the separate challenges we face.

Beyond these universal values, I also harbor a certain hope in regards to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. After a fresh phase of horrific faith-based violence, relations between at least parts of the Muslim world and the West seem to be at a precipice. Israel — and its relationship to Palestine — is so often the epicentre. At such a time, I feel that every constructive human connection counts.


Dahlia ScheindlinDahlia Scheindlin is an independent public opinion researcher and political strategist, as well as a doctoral candidate and lecturer at Tel Aviv University. She blogs at +972 Magazine.

This article was published by the Common Ground News Service on October 2, 2012. Copyright permission is granted for publication.

Pololu Valley, The Big Island, Hawaii

In response to our interview with Esther Sternberg in "The Science of Healing Places," Jenny Schroedel sent us this photo via Facebook with the caption:

"My favorite healing place: Pololu Valley, The Big Island, Hawaii."

Brandenburg GateHistory meets modernity at the Brandenburg Gate in Berlin, Germany. Photo by Sebastian Niedlich/Flickr, cc by-nc-sa 2.0

Several recent incidents in Berlin have escalated tensions between Muslims, Jews, and the city's secular majority. Over a month ago, Rabbi Daniel Saltera rabbi wearing a kippa, or yarmulke, was beaten by four "Arab-looking" youths after being asked if he and his daughter were Jewish. Public outcry led to a large demonstration in support of Berlin's Jews, including a flash mob of Jews and non-Jews wearing kippot.

Tensions escalated days later when a second incident, in which Jewish school girls were harassed by a group of youths that included a girl wearing a head scarf, led to an exchange of harsh words between Jewish and Muslim leaders, though in neither case were the attackers caught or identified definitively. After being advised to urge greater religious tolerance, Muslim leaders denied responsibility for the attacks and pointed out their own experiences of intolerance in the city.

Then on Yom Kippur, two more anti-Semitic incidents took place — the first when a young white man threatened a local Jewish leader and told him to go back where he came from, and the second when a mother and her daughter were forced out of a taxi after telling the "German" driver they were going to synagogue. Diedre Berger of the Berlin office of the American Jewish Committee has now intervened, asking the German government to develop an action plan to combat anti-Semitism.

Meanwhile, a contrasting alliance between Jews and Muslims has formed in the aftermath of a regional court ruling against circumcision. Government and religious leaders, including Chancellor Angela Merkel, have denounced it and announced plans to create government regulations allowing circumcisions to be performed. And in Berlin, a demonstration against the case featured Jewish and Muslim leaders "united for circumcision," according to a headline in the Tageszeitung. Religious leaders at the demonstration welcomed the chance to work together — despite current tensions — against what they consider to be the greater adversary of secular intolerance toward religion.

It was against this background that public attention shifted to the global conflict over the anti-Islamic film, The Innocence of Muslims. In Berlin, right-wing nationalists announced plans to bring American pastor Terry Jones to Berlin for a showing of the anti-Muslim film, but the government blocked his visit, and the event did not take place.

Observant Jews and Muslims constitute small minorities in Berlin, though people of Turkish descent number around a quarter of a million. The Jewish community of Berlin has about 11,000 active members, a fraction of the city's total Jewish population. Self-identified Christians are more numerous, but even they are greatly outnumbered by non-practicing and unaffiliated Berliners. In a city famous for decadent nightclubs and countercultural artists, religion has become a kind of curiosity.

The recent "Long Night of Religions" featured open houses at sixty-five different religious organizations, ranging from Buddhist and Muslim to Quaker and Sikh. A smaller event featuring Christians in particular, the Berlin Festival of Churches (with an appearance by pop-star-turned-Christian Nina Hagen) followed two weeks later.

All of these stories have received significant attention in local and national media.

But "religious" issues can only be understood in the larger context of "secularized" Berlin. What other factors divide and unite Berliners? How do conflicts and alliances between religious minorities reflect dynamics within the majority? Political, economic, social, generational, and aesthetic divisions are obvious, but economic and cultural indicators suggest that the greater sources of division remain the Cold War and the two World Wars in which Berlin was a geographic and political center.

Berliner Walter Benjamin (1892-1940) identified the culture of distraction as a key political feature of modern life. Debates over how to memorialize the past, renovate neighborhoods and public places, and manage economic changes preoccupy Germans ambivalent about the image and swelling budget of their capital city. It is no wonder that a city so burdened with history succeeds so well at providing diversions, from new beach volleyball venues to all-night techno parties. But without a broad discussion of German and Berliner identity, the status of minorities here remains uncertain, leading Jewish leader Charlotte Knoblauch to ask, "Do you still want us Jews?"

For residents still grappling with a catastrophic modern history, the concerns of Jewish and Muslim minorities could either serve as an interesting distraction or a chance to examine the markers and dynamics of "secular" identity in Berlin.


Brian BrittBrian Britt is a professor in the Department of Religion and Culture at Virginia Tech. His most recent book is Biblical Curses and the Displacement of Tradition. He is currently a guest fellow at the Zentrum für Literatur- und Kulturforschung in Berlin working on a book about Walter Benjamin and religion.

This essay is reprinted with permission of Sightings from the Martin Marty Center at the University of Chicago Divinity School.

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Krista Tippett, David Gushee, and Frances Kissling at On Being's "Pro-Life, Pro-Choice, Pro-Dialogue"Krista Tippett speaks with David Gushee and Frances Kissling at the University of Minnesota's Humphrey Institute. Photo by Matt Johnson

More than 500 people witnessed a thoughtful exchange between two people who come at the abortion issue from decidedly different perspectives. What they heard was a civil exchange based upon mutual respect. As one listener points out, it has a lot to do with the way Krista framed the conversation:

"I intend to use Krista's questions about exploring what makes you uncomfortable on your own side, what you admire in the other, to probe more deeply into areas in which I'm so sure I'm right. The answers were wonderfully open, vulnerable, and honest. I hope I can use the openness as a model and find others who want to dialogue in this way. They're not easy to find."

And this conversation continues next week. This Tuesday, Krista is leading a discussion at the Brookings Institution with former Republican senator Pete Domenici and Alice Rivlin, an economist who headed the Office of Management and Budget and Congressional Budget Office.

Boundary Waters Vacation ReadingAfter watching the first presidential debate, many of us recognize the need for new ways to have civil conversations about the debt crisis and fiscal policy. We'll be live streaming this dialogue. Watch along online or, if you're in the Washington DC area, join us in person. If you do, please stop by and say hello (looking forward to meeting you Chris Abraham and Stephanie Dahle!).

But, before this...

In D.C. (well, Bethesda) for the Religion Newswriters Association gathering. I'm interviewing Eckhart Tolle tomorrow.

As Krista tweets above, she's talking to the influential spiritual teacher in front of her fellow religion journalists. We decided not record this conversation since she interviewed him in 2008 for our show, The Power of Eckhart Tolle's Now"The Power of Eckhart Tolle's Now." Even then, hundreds of people responded with powerful testimonials about how his books and philosophy impacted their lives — like this reflection from Barbara Harrington:

"I recently was diagnosed with non-Hodgkins lymphoma, completed chemo, and found his books invaluable during the long winter months of this year. While the chemo was beating the cancer, I had to find ways to beat that incessant "monkey mind," which was anxiety-filled about the future and certainly not wanting to stay in the "now." Learning how to lean into this difficult and yet growth-filled time in my life was a challenge and Eckhart's wisdom, so steeped in Buddhism, was amazingly calming and joyous for me."

And on Wednesday, Krista and the team will dash back to Minneapolis and conclude the CCP series with a public event centering on the future of marriage. As our civilization struggles with how to define marriage, Krista will speak with two men who have been on both sides of the gay marriage debate and see a way beyond acrimony. Perhaps they can provide ideas and tools for healing our fractured civic spaces around this contentious issue. Like all our other events, you can reserve your seat at the Humphrey School of Public Affairs, or watch the live video stream with Jonathan Rauch and David Blankenhorn.

I'd be remiss if I didn't end on a bit of a lighter note and share some of my favorite tweets from Krista (@KristaTippett), such as this this reflection on 140 characters:

My first two weeks on Twitter. A revelation that so many of my thoughts are just this size.

Lulav and Etrog at Zucotti ParkShe also recommended a number of articles to read — from a piece in Slate...

Something sweet for Sunday then Twitter Sabbath until tomorrow: TY @DianeWinston for Cookies and the Human Condition

...to a commentary by Steve Coll:

Refreshing clarity on the meme of "Muslim Rage" in The New Yorker. A must read.

Beck Does Philip GlassFrom On Being's Twitter stream (@Beingtweets), a delightfully unexpected confluence of two fantastic musicians:

Beck doing a 20-minute remix of Philip Glass. How can we not listen?

And, continue to send us your feedback about our shows. Share your suggestions and critiques on Facebook or Twitter (@beingtweets, @KristaTippett, @TrentGilliss).

"And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing."<br />
-1 Corinthians 13:2 (ESV) photo by Magnus Stivi
Photo by Magnus Stivi/Flickr, cc by-nc 2.0

Each day of the week we pair a photograph with a quotation and upload it to Instagram. Oftentimes, these lines are inspired by something our staff or our audiences are reading and discussing. We hope to offer deeper reflection and inspiration into your social media lives. This Monday, I drew my inspiration from a class I'm taking called Rhetorical Stylistics:

And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.

—1 Corinthians 13:2 (ESV)

I chose this verse from the New Testament after learning about a stylistic figure called a polysyndeton. It's a figure of speech that uses many conjunctions between clauses to slow down the rhythm of a sentence. It gives you time to pause and reflect, and deliver you to a different place for the conclusion — maybe to accept it or be surprised by it. There's also a feeling of drama, of building towards the conclusion. The Bible has a wealth of beautiful polysyndetons like the one above.

This verse opens with a clear "If ---> Then" statement so you know the conclusion is coming, but did you realize how bold, surprising, and impactful it would be? Imagine if the verse had been more direct, less stylized. Permit me to play with this sacred text for a minute to imagine a world without polysyndetons:

I am nothing without love even with prophetic powers to understand all mysteries and knowledge, and faith to remove mountains.

Without the polysyndeton, my translation is thin, the meaning diluted; "prophetic powers" and "all faith" don't look like such awful dilemmas in this order after all!

"I came, I saw, I conquered."
—Julius Augustus Caesar

Caesar, on the other hand, left out all of the conjunctions to speed up the verse when announcing his swift victory. This is the asyndeton form.

Frederick Douglass Artwork
Frederick Douglass, a master orator and statesman, effectively used this device in many speeches, including "What to the Slave is the Fourth of July?":

What, to the American slave, is your 4th of July? I answer: a day that reveals to him, more than all other days in the year, the gross injustice and cruelty to which he is the constant victim.

To him, your celebration is a sham; your boasted liberty, an unholy license; your national greatness, swelling vanity; your sounds of rejoicing are empty and heartless; your denunciations of tyrants, brass fronted impudence; your shouts of liberty and equality, hollow mockery; your prayers and hymns, your sermons and thanksgivings, with all your religious parade, and solemnity, are, to him, mere bombast, fraud, deception, impiety, and hypocrisy — a thin veil to cover up crimes which would disgrace a nation of savages.

There is not a nation on the earth guilty of practices, more shocking and bloody, than are the people of these United States, at this very hour.

It's truly rousing, you can feel the fire building in your chest as he moves through the "thin veil" just reading it, let alone hearing it. Many scholars argue that employing similar rhetorical devices as present in the Bible was one key to Douglass's rhetorical mastery. Like the Bible, the Declaration of Independence was considered unassailable. Imagine the sound of his voice then, to hear the man thunder away at the words of this precious document using style to take aim and make his point.

Image of Frederick Douglass by Christopher Clark/Flickr, cc by-nc-sa 2.0

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Over the course of this month, we're hosting a series of public events that encourages civil conversations about the most difficult of topics — abortion and gay marriage included. We're asking ourselves how can we model better, kinder ways of communicating and disagreeing with each other. This morning, Jennifer Livingston, a television anchor at WKBT in La Crosse, Wisconsin, demonstrated this civility in spades.

A viewer emailed Ms. Livingston a note chastising her for her weight. She never named the author, but she did use it as an opportunity to talk about bullying and treating people more kindly. Here's what she said during this morning's broadcast:

I want to take a moment to address a situation that has become a talking point in this community over the past weekend — especially on Facebook — that centers around me. On Friday, I recieved the following e-mail from a La Crosse man with the subject line "Community responsibility." It reads as follows:

Hi Jennifer,

It's unusual that I see your morning show, but I did so for a very short time today. I was surprised indeed to witness that your physical condition hasn't improved for many years. Surely you don't consider yourself a suitable example for this community's young people, girls in particular. Obesity is one of the worst choices a person can make and one of the most dangerous habits to maintain. I leave you this note hoping that you'll reconsider your responsibility as a local public personality to present and promote a healthy lifestyle.

Now those of us in the media get a healthy dose of critiques from our viewers throughout the year — and we realize it comes with having a job in the public eye. But this email was more than that. While I tried my best to laugh off the very hurtful attack on my appearance, my colleagues could not do the same. Especially my husband, our 6 and 10 anchor Mike Thompson.

Mike posted this email on his WKBT Facebook page — and what happened next has been truly inspiring. Hundreds and hundreds of people have taken the time out of their day to not only lift my spirits, but take a stand that attacks like this are not okay. More on that in a second.

But first, the truth is I am overweight. You could call me fat. And yes, even obese on a doctor's chart. But to the person who wrote me that letter, do you think I don't know that? That your cruel words are pointing out something I don't see? You don't know me. You are not a friend of mine. You are not a part of my family and you have admitted you don't watch this show. So you know nothing about me but what you see on the outside. I am so much more than a number on a scale.

And here's where I want us all to learn something from this. If you didn't already know, October is National Anti-Bullying month. And this is a problem that is growing everyday in our schools and on the Internet. It is a major issue in the lives of young people today, and, as the mother of three young girls, it scares me to death. Now I am a grown woman.

And lucky for me, I have a very thick skin — literally as that email pointed out — and otherwise. And that man's words mean nothing to me. But what really angers me about this? There are children who don't know better, who get emails as critical as the one I received or, in many cases, even worse — each and every day.

The Internet has become a weapon. Our schools a battleground. And this behavior is learned; it is passed down from people like the man who wrote me that email. If you are at home talking about the fat news lady, guess what? Your children are probably going to go to school and call someone fat. We need to teach our kids how to be kind — not critical — and we need to do that by example.

So many of you have come to my defense over the past four days. I am literally overwhelmed by your words.

To my colleagues and friends from today and from years ago, my family, my amazing husband, and so many of you out there that I will probably never have the opportunity to meet: I will never be able to thank you enough for you words of support. And for taking a stand against this bully. We are better than that email. We are better than the bullies that would try to take us down.

And I leave you with this. To all the children out there who feel lost, who are struggling with weight, the color of your skin, your sexual preference, your disability — even the acne on your face — listen to me right now. Do not let your self worth be defined by bullies. Learn from my experience that the the cruel words of one are nothing compared to the shouts of many.

Boundary Waters Vacation Reading

This weekend we asked people to send us photos of their favorite sacred spaces and healing places, and then we'd share them with our readers. Robyn Hendrix posted this fun photo on our Facebook page with the caption:

"Some great Boundary Waters vacation reading."

A majestic environment in upstate Minnesota and our host's best-selling book, Einstein's God makes for a great pairing!

Assisi SunsetSunset over the Basilica of Saint Francis in Assisi, Italy. (Photo by NKCPhoto/Flickr, cc by-nc-nd 2.0)

"Off to the place I love best: the airport!"


These words Krista uttered with a twinkle in her eye and a bit of tongue-in-cheek pithiness as she rushed out of the studio on her way to Chicago. But didn't she just tweet something about returning home, you ask? Yes, yes she did:

Off the plane, hug my son, do yoga - back on the ground and in my body. A relief. Life's simplest moorings to dignity.


I'd venture that Esther Sternberg, our guest on this week's show on the science of healing places, would recommend finding a well-designed space with some windows, a view of some trees, and a labyrinth in Minneapolis-St. Paul Airport to help reduce her physical stress levels. If you've got some recommendations for places to escape, leave her a tweet at @KristaTippett. She's all about Twitter now!

As you might recall, Krista was in Assisi, Italy until Monday this week. There she met a smart young duo from Brooklyn, John Cary and Courtney MartinCourtney Martin, who attended her breakout session with NYU film professor Marco Williams on the role of love in the media and journalism. Ms. Martin (@courtwrites) quoted Krista on Twitter:

We are turn of century people, living in a remarkable moment in history, revisiting basic questions & assumptions. @kristatippett

The great challenge is how we live together, into a peaceable future, while holding passionate disagreement. @kristatippett


John CaryWhile John logged these points:

"People who are angry, are the first to throw themselves in front of microphones." @KristaTippett of @BeingTweets

Hearing her speak, I'm reminded that one of my all-time fave @TEDTalks is @KristaTippett's talk on compassion bit.ly/hI9Lu2

"The definition of news is things that are exceptional and dramatic...but they shape our norm." @KristaTippett of @BeingTweets


It wasn't all work though — a mix of sweets...

Taking a break from holiness in Assisi and admiring the meringues.

Cioccolata con Panna. There is a God.


... and contemplation:

The fine, porous line between passion and ego. The precipice between righteous and self-righteous.


Two days after her return, she interviewed Frances Kissling and David Gushee on life and choice at the Humphrey School of Public Affairs. Twitter Exchange Between Fr. Hines and Krista TippettWhile preparing, she asked:

What if life and choice are both gifts, not rights? How would we have to take up this matter differently?


To which Fr. Chip Hines (@Chines), a Catholic priest from Medford, Massachusetts, responded:

@kristatippett life is a gift not a right, we do not choose to be born, God chooses us for a purpose, our choice is how we live out the gift


And Krista also recommended reading "Talking with the Enemy", an "astonishing, under-noticed report after five years of a secret abortion dialogue in Boston" from the Public Conversations Project:

"Since that first fear-filled meeting, we have experienced a paradox. While learning to treat each other with dignity and respect, we all have become firmer in our views about abortion.

We hope this account of our experience will encourage people everywhere to consider engaging in dialogues about abortion and other protracted disputes. In this world of polarizing conflicts, we have glimpsed a new possibility: a way in which people can disagree frankly and passionately, become clearer in heart and mind about their activism, and, at the same time, contribute to a more civil and compassionate society."


We did receive some criticism for holding this Civil Conversations discussion on a sacred Jewish holiday. Joan Eisenstodt tweeted:

@kristatippett Interesting program in Minneapolis tomorrow - stunned it's being held on Yom Kippur. Would it have been held on Christmas?!


It's a fair question. In the rush to book dates and busy travel schedules of our speakers, we neglected to check our calendars. Rabbi Sharon BrousWe hope the serious discussion that ensued was respectful of this most solemn day in the Jewish year. Our deepest apologies.

But, we weren't totally unaware of the High Holy Days. On our Facebook page and Twitter, we hearkened back to our show on the Days of Awe":

This interview with Rabbi Sharon Brous should be required listening for so many of us. And, with the High Holy Days in full swing, it couldn't be more relevant!


And, we blogged two delightful pieces: Shari Motro's joyful lamentation over sealed spaces and the lessons Rosh Hashanah — and the Yom Kippur greeting cardHigh Holy Days — teaches when we have access to the gifts of our natural environment, and Tablet Magazine's e-cards for the High Holy Days, a humorous, light-hearted (and slightly irreverent) approach from inside the tradition.

And, we continue to solicit your advice and feedback on this newsletter. Ruth Cromwell was kind enough to send us this note:

"The snippets from your travels in this email newsletter are wonderful; entices me to read on. And I do, with downloading podcasts, listening to them as I take my walks. Inspirational and informative walking!"


And, Roberta Young left us with this thought:

"I am blessed by this email. Would like to see more Bible quotes when possible. Thanks and Blessings to all."


Please, send us your comments so we can make this newsletter (Is "newsletter" an outdated term?) serve you better.

Get hold of us any way you like: reply to this email, contact us on our website, share your suggestions and critiques on Facebook or Twitter (@beingtweets, @KristaTippett, @TrentGilliss).

Secret Meeting
photo by Alison Inconstanti/Flickr, cc by-nc-sa 2.0

During her introduction to last night's discussion with Frances Kissling and David Gushee, Krista recommended the audience read an "astonishing" article from the Public Conversations Project titled "Talking with the Enemy."

In 1994, John Salvi shot and killed Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols. Both were receptionists at Preterm Health Services and Planned Parenthood Clinic, respectively. Following this public tragedy, six leaders on both sides of the abortion debate decided to meet "in secret in an attempt to better understand each other":

"In the evening of Dec. 30, 1995, about 700 people gathered at Temple Ohabei Shalom in Brookline to honor the memory of Lowney and Nichols. All our prochoice participants attended the service. Fowler and Gamble officiated. In the solemn crowd were Podziba, one of our facilitators, and two of our prolife members, Hogan and Thorp, accompanied by David Thorp, her husband.

'Seeing the other members of the group walk in was one of the most meaningful moments of the service for me,' Fowler recalls.

In her remarks, Gamble expressed gratitude 'for the prayers of those who agree with us and the prayers of those who disagree.'

Fowler, in her sermon, reminded us of the 'God who calls out to all who love peace.' She drew from the words of the Hebrew prophet Isaiah, saying 'and new things have sprung forth in the year since Lee Ann's and Shannon's deaths. Much has been transformed, and much will be.'"

The participants share their stance on the issues, their anxieties about meeting with the other, and some essential ground rules for civil conversation:

"To help us listen and speak across this divide, ground rules were critical. We would seek to use terms acceptable (or at least tolerable) to all participants. We would not interrupt, grandstand, or make personal attacks. We would speak for ourselves, not as representatives of organizations. Most important, the meetings would be completely confidential unless all of us could agree upon a way to go public.

We also made a commitment that some of us still find agonizingly difficult: to shift our focus away from arguing for our cause. This agreement was designed to prevent rancorous debates.

And indeed, we believe this ground rule has been essential to the long life of our dialogue. Knowing that our ideas would be challenged, but not attacked, we have been able to listen openly and speak candidly.

But it has not been easy."

There was also a surprising outcome:

"Since that first fear-filled meeting, we have experienced a paradox. While learning to treat each other with dignity and respect, we all have become firmer in our views about abortion.

We hope this account of our experience will encourage people everywhere to consider engaging in dialogues about abortion and other protracted disputes. In this world of polarizing conflicts, we have glimpsed a new possibility: a way in which people can disagree frankly and passionately, become clearer in heart and mind about their activism, and, at the same time, contribute to a more civil and compassionate society."

And yet the conversation did not end:

"These conversations revealed a deep divide. We saw that our differences on abortion reflect two world views that are irreconcilable.

If this is true, then why do we continue to meet?

First, because when we face our opponent, we see her dignity and goodness. Embracing this apparent contradiction stretches us spiritually. We've experienced something radical and life-altering that we describe in nonpolitical terms: 'the mystery of love,' 'holy ground,' or simply, 'mysterious.'

We continue because we are stretched intellectually, as well. This has been a rare opportunity to engage in sustained, candid conversations about serious moral disagreements. It has made our thinking sharper and our language more precise.

We hope, too, that we have become wiser and more effective leaders. We are more knowledgeable about our political opponents. We have learned to avoid being overreactive and disparaging to the other side and to focus instead on affirming our respective causes."

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Riyaaz QawwaliPhoto by Gil Seo

Many people, myself included, believe that art can build bridges. But the same day that a new festival started in New York that was supposed to do just that, the world was aflame because of another piece of art.

I have been to a fair number of programs where an artistic expression is considered a panacea. There is little thought to curation, conversation, or contemplation. Like anything of value, to make art a tool for bridge-building takes effort. When I attended the opening night of the Locating the Sacred Festival, I heard and saw the power I believe that art has. It was not only well-conceived, but it was also living proof that difference doesn’t have to lead to exclusion.

That night, it was cooperation and transformation on display. The night was passionate, and the performers were exquisite. It was a night that ruptured the vision of the world I had before going to the Church of the Ascension.

I went to sleep the evening of this September 11th, thinking that New York City felt close to normal that day; we really were healing. The morning of September 12th, I woke up at 5 a.m. and offered prayers, then went to my email.

Benghazi was in the news, the American embassy was attacked, and I would shortly find out that Ambassador Chris Stevens was killed. I worked on the #NoToViolence campaign. Buddhist Monks Open the Locating the Sacred FestivalThe dread I had missed the day before had returned. As the day wore on, it became clear that Libyans were disgusted with the works of al-Qaeda, and people in the U.S. were able to understand that Muslims were not inherently violent and anti-American. I wasn't elated, or even hopeful by the end of the day, but at least I wasn't defeated.

However, the last thing I wanted to do was attend the opening of the Asian American Arts Alliance's Locating the Sacred Festival.

I was exhausted. My mind was in a political state, not a spiritual or aesthetic one. The idea of seeing Buddhist monks, a contemporary experimental musician, and a qawwali group perform in a church just didn't seem like a good thing. It felt contrived and not really respectful to the events of the day.

But I went. I was cynical. I walked in and started criticizing everything.

The qawwali performers were set up in front of a big cross, which is a difficult symbol for many Muslims to deal with, as we do not believe in the crucifixion of Jesus. The Buddhist monks came out and did their blessing chant, and people started applauding. They started applauding! It was a prayer and they were clapping!

I wasn't critical anymore. I was angry. Angry at the events of the day. Angry at the fact that people would clap at a prayer. And I took a breath. I was still angry, but I understood my anger. Where was God that day? I had not witnessed God Glory and Majesty, and I was being faced with people who had come for performance.

Then I thought about the monks. U Pyinya Zawta was introduced as being one of the leaders of Burma's Saffron Revolution.

He was a religious leader in exile, but he was in front of a crowd, offering a prayer that earned applause.

It was a reminder. A reminder that one always has to struggle to experience the Divine. That devotion is performance. It's not always done for the "audience." But the audience can get something out of it. And I stopped. And I listened. And I looked for the sacred.

I wanted to take each presenter on their own terms, but I needed to have them work on mine. You can never know the author's intent, and when it is an attempt to bridge you to a greater state of consciousness, isn't it ultimately about the listener's experience? The evening was an experience.

Religion is revolutionary. It was, is, and will be a catalyst for change. The Burmese monks were living proof of that. Marx may have thought that religion was the opiate of the masses, but he never thought about how radical it was to have to, in the language of the Sufis, polish the mirror of the heart to see yourself and the world anew. That is a radical act. There is the societal revolution and there is the personal revolution, and they are linked.

Bora Yoon

Bora Yoon was introduced as doing something sublime. It was a good description. My ear is not accustomed to contemporary experimental music. I'm happy that I can appreciate 4'33" by John Cage. Yoon plays with "found things," including old instruments, things that would not traditionally be called instruments, and sounds. She has an ethereal voice that sounds like it would be at home in the Choir at the Church of the Ascension, which it is, or in the Elvish kingdoms of The Lord of the Rings.

One of her found sounds was of a subway, which she explained came from an elevated line near the Triborough Bridge in Astoria, Queens. As a New Yorker, it was a sound that instantly made me feel comfortable. I realized the rhythm of the clackity-clack of the wheels was the rhythm of a dhikr, or remembrance of God. I was, at the moment, experiencing important parts of who I was as a person: New Yorker and Muslim. It was also a reminder that God can be found in the everyday.

The combination of Yoon's voice and the electronic components helped create a bridge between the trappings of the modern and sense of spirituality as being ancient. The stories were inverted, and technology was ancient, with spirituality being modern. Perhaps that is the state of affairs we are entering. Twitter and the writing stick are both technology, and we are coming to grips with our own spiritualities now. And when I think about the prayer of the monks, with nothing but their voices, it makes me wonder if we can only understand a mediated spirituality.

With that thought in my mind, we entered intermission.

Crowd Await at Opening Night of the Locating the Sacred Festival

I looked at the stage again. My eye was once more drawn to the cross on the wall.

Riyaaz Qawwali at the Church of the Ascension

There is a Muslim theologian who argues that the cross, not the crucifix, should become an acceptable symbol for Muslims. It's a reminder of humanity's broken relationship with God, that we could have treated Jesus, a prophet of God, in such a degrading manner. If devotion is to help bridge that divide between creation and the Creator, than starting with a reminder of that rupture seemed important. I also realized that the Muslims who would be offended by a cross would probably not be setting foot inside a church, or listening to devotional music.

Above the cross were two angels holding a chalice, and it reminded me of a couplet by the famous Persian poet Hafiz. He writes,

Last night I saw the angels knocking on the tavern door
They took the clay of Adam and fashioned a goblet.

It's a dense verse, but a powerful one. In Muslim thought, angels have no free will. They want to become like humans, who can choose to love God. One can become intoxicated on the love of God, and this is compared to drinking wine. Therefore, the tavern is where Sufis, mystics, go to drink of that love. Since the angels cannot choose to love God, they cannot enter. They try to mimic the experience by taking the clay of Adam and creating a goblet, presumed to be in the form of human, to receive the love of God.

Underneath the angels and above the cross was the inscription, "This do in remembrance of me." (Luke 22:19). The quote echoes a verse in the Qur'an, "Remember the name of your Lord" (73:8), which is one of the verses that Sufis use to explain their participation in dhikr, remembering God's name. Dhikr is the basis of sama', or the spiritual concert, of which qawwali is one type. Flanking the cross on either side were images of angels with wings that would be at home on Persianate representations of angels. Decorating the moldings for the organ pipes were peacocks, which are the birds of Paradise in Muslim lore. I had moved — from being distrustful of the site to appreciating all these signs of connection amongst traditions.

Riyaaz Qawwali

Then the qawwals came on stage and they started singing "Allah Hu," a fast-paced qawwali and sure crowd-pleaser. They stopped after a minute. It was a sound check. But a good one. The phrase means "God is." You, as the listener, fill in whatever you want after the verb. The lacuna is powerful. Those in the audience who were familiar with the tradition were clearly energized.

Crowd at Locating the Sacred FestivalThe group members of Riyaaz Qawwali were trained in various different traditions, but they say they were brought together by their love of the art of qawwali. While all of South Asian heritage based in Austin, Texas, they are unusual amongst modern qawwals in that they are not all Muslim. In some ways, that seems very modern, to have so many non-Muslims involved in a genre of music identified as Muslim devotional. In other ways, it seems normal.

Qawwali has been consumed by non-Muslims in South Asia for generations. It is about the power of the blessing, or baraka, that the music is supposed to invoke. There is little doubt that Hindus and Sikhs participated as qawwals, and contributed to the text.

Riyaaz Qawwali plays to their multi-religious background, saying on their site that their recordings will include devotionals from HIndu and Sikh traditions. That sort of melding of lyrical tradition into qawwali is not unusual, and they gave a preview with a performance that included the refrain “Ishwar Allah donoñ tera naam” (“Ishwar [an Indic name for God], Allah [an Arabic name for God] both are your name”).

Riyaaz Qawwali at the Church of the AscensionThey ended their solo set with a well-known song in the genre, “Shahbaz Qalandar.” It was the perfect piece to end with, as it was upbeat and demands participation. More importantly, it is in honor of a figure that is a conflation of two separate figures: Lal Shahbaz, a Muslim mystic, and Jhule Lal, a Hindu deity, who become melded in folklore. The song is about the organic ways in which we come together.

The last song the group was going to perform is a traditional opening or closing song, “Man Kunto Maula.” It is an Arabic phrase that refers to Prophet Muhammad naming Ali as his successor. For Sufis, this is an important moment in history for the transmission of spiritual knowledge.

Riyaaz Qawwali was supposed to perform with Bora Yoon, but technical problems prevented that from happening. However, I could imagine the earthiness of the voice of the qawwals playing against the ethereal quality of Yoon’s; religious traditions, and body and spirit, coming together. While Yoon’s voice was missed, the combinations were still there. The body in motion, the cultures coming together through words, which elevated the spirit, could not have been a better way to end.

That absence of God I had felt, and the cynicism I walked in with was gone. This experience was a hopeful one, not aspirational, but grounded in a reality of that environment. It was a way to locate the sacred.

Photos by Gil Seo, except fifth photo from the top by George Hirose.


Hussein RashidHussein Rashid is a faculty member at Hofstra University and associate editor at Religion Dispatches. He is the convener of islamicate and a contributor to Talk Islam and AltMuslimah; his work has appeared at City of Brass, Goat Milk, and CNN.com. He has appeared on CBS Evening News, CNN, Russia Today, Channel 4 (UK), State of Belief - Air America Radio, and Iqra TV (Saudi Arabia).

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