Your program with Jennifer Michael Hecht reminded me of the philosopher Gene Gendlin. Hecht says "I don't believe there's any thinking to the universe." But of course there is thinking to the universe, because the universe includes us. Somehow, the nature of the universe is such that we are possible. The apparent conflict between science and religion is an artifact of a particular way of thinking (a model of reality) that developed during the scientific revolution and has become confused with science. But the model must have something wrong with it, because it can't explain us: "Since our human bodies have environments including … objects, meanings, and symbols, we know that living bodies can have objects, meanings, and symbols. Let us therefore not build the 'basic' terms in our model in a way that makes our own bodies seem impossible from the start."
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